Thanks for the comments. Regarding your first question: by “substance,” I mean, “that which the nation is composed of”. Israel grows when Gentiles come to be a part of Israel, whereas they had previously not been a part of her before. Of course, God is the only One who makes Israel grow, but one of the ways he does so is by making Gentiles a part of Israel’s “substance,” or in other words, by changing their nature so that they are true Israelites indeed. Does that make more sense?

Question #2:

I think that the root of the olive tree in Romans 11 has to do with the forefathers who first received God’s promise and were first made to be his people. I say this because of verse 18, where Paul exhorts the Gentiles believers not to boast against the Jews, because they (the Gentile believers) do not bear the root, but the root bears them. This seems to me to be somewhat parallel to verse 24, which teaches that the Gentile believers are grafted into the tree against nature. In other words, it is “natural” for the Jewish believers to be part of God’s people, since they by nature spring from the “root,” that is, the forefathers to whom the first promises were made; Gentile believers are now connected to this root against nature, which seems to indicate that they were grafted in against ethnicity whereas the Jews by ethnic descent from the root were natural branches. Of course, I could be wrong, and would be open to hearing more support that the root may be referring to Christ. That would certainly be in keeping with other scriptures where he is, for example, the vine which supports all the branches (John 15).

Question #3:

I fully agree with your explanation of Isaiah 65; I think it is a good case of Hebraic poetic imagery. It would be difficult to reconcile it to other clear, non-poetic passages of scripture if we insist on being bound by a stilted literalism that refuses to take literary genre into account.

Thanks again for the comments, and blessings in the Name of the Savior, Nathan

In Romans 11, is the nourishing root of the olive tree Christ?

In Isaiah 65:17 and on, I believe it to be talking of when Christ comes back and we are living on the new earth. Someone I am debating states that it can’t be because of Isaiah talking about people living to be 100yr then dying and children being born etc.but I think it is because of verse 17. Here is part of what I told her: ” Many times the Bible uses (and I’m sure there is a word for what I am about to describe but I don’t know it) poetic-like talk when it wants to describe things we know of in our daily lives…things we are very familiar with and wants to give the listener a sense of embellishment yet we know it to be an understatement. Clear as mud right? Ok, for example God says He owns the cattle on a thousand hills. We know that He owns all the cattle on every hill because we know what Scripture teaches us about God and what He owns. But that is a poetic-like way of describing His ownership which would sound embellished to the listener of poetry yet when we “come out of” the poetry mode back into reality we know it is much more. See what I mean? So when these verses talk about living long, not toiling in vain or having children go to doom, it’s talking in a poetic way of the curse of sin being lifted. These people and we ourselves know of the pain and weeping of death and children dying early and all the struggles of life and the hardships of everyday life (especially those living in 3rd world countries). This is talking about getting rid of these pains as a whole that we bear each day. It isn’t saying that on the new earth each person will get to live 100yrs and we will have children on the new earth etc.”

However, in light of your extreme knowledge of this book (I have none), I would like to know what you think chapter 65 is talking about. Thank you for your time.